Comments on: If… http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/ Carl McColman ~ The Fullness of Joy is to Behold God in All Tue, 22 May 2012 04:20:38 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Ken http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2921 Ken Sat, 22 Dec 2007 20:04:06 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2921 Very provocative questions. I often feel that life is too busy to be a mystic but then I read things like your "choppin' broccoli" quote and <a href="http://punctum-saliens.org/2007/08/28/whatever-you-do-do-it-all-for-the-glory-of-god/" rel="nofollow">there remains only standing up, sitting down ...</a> and I wonder what it is that I'm missing. It seems so simple that it seems impossible. Something else I've been wondering about lately: do you need a guru (or master or guide or ...) to be a mystic? Is it possible to figure it out for yourself (with the help of reading, of course)? It seems that almost every mystic I've heard about either had a guru or had some direct revelation from God. Since the latter is not happening for me, I"m wondering if I'm wasting my time without seeking out a guru. But then I consider St. Paul who, some would say, was a mystic and I wonder whether that single, brief encounter with Jesus could account for it. I don't know but would be interested in hearing what you think. Thanks for writing Very provocative questions. I often feel that life is too busy to be a mystic but then I read things like your “choppin’ broccoli” quote and there remains only standing up, sitting down … and I wonder what it is that I’m missing. It seems so simple that it seems impossible.

Something else I’ve been wondering about lately: do you need a guru (or master or guide or …) to be a mystic? Is it possible to figure it out for yourself (with the help of reading, of course)? It seems that almost every mystic I’ve heard about either had a guru or had some direct revelation from God. Since the latter is not happening for me, I”m wondering if I’m wasting my time without seeking out a guru. But then I consider St. Paul who, some would say, was a mystic and I wonder whether that single, brief encounter with Jesus could account for it.

I don’t know but would be interested in hearing what you think.

Thanks for writing

]]> By: John http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2920 John Fri, 21 Dec 2007 12:09:58 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2920 personal answers to your questions. Prayer time- i dont belive this should be too regimented. Although routine can aid development. Be aware of Lectio - this must be used correctly. All that you do and say should be offered in prayer as a start. Continue to devleop prayer life, do not expect to run before you can walk. Church- I do not find the Church interferes, the Church is there to provide the assistances etc needed to assist on the journey. Also the truth upheld by the Church is free from personal bias and so can be used as a bench mark to hold up personal thinking. Relationships- other than the time that may be required for prayer etc, this in truth delveops and deepens personal relationships, whilst not necessarily relating to mhystical experiences. having had such empathy enables great building of relatioships at depths greater that possible before. however sometimes it is a very lonley life. (The path of the shadow of the Cross must be followed in isolation) Secrets etc. the Mysical life does not embrace secrets, for in secrets negative can breed and develop, bringing a risk of loss of focus that is truly needed. there are no secrets with our Lord, and as such each must be taken in turn and dealt with. annialiation of the effect of the outer as described by John of the Cross, the only way to purge the Outer errant man, to enabel the raised man of being to be recognised. work- work must be performed to the best of ability pleasing to God, Irespective of profession. St Francis de Sales Introduction to the Devout Life can give you some ideas on how to live in the world and seek God. One final point- wear the full armour of God, it is the only way to protect yourself, on this path. there are many pitfalls along the way. Hope this is of help to you on your journey. God Bless. if i can be of any other help i will be glad to. personal answers to your questions.
Prayer time- i dont belive this should be too regimented. Although routine can aid development. Be aware of Lectio – this must be used correctly. All that you do and say should be offered in prayer as a start. Continue to devleop prayer life, do not expect to run before you can walk.
Church- I do not find the Church interferes, the Church is there to provide the assistances etc needed to assist on the journey. Also the truth upheld by the Church is free from personal bias and so can be used as a bench mark to hold up personal thinking.
Relationships- other than the time that may be required for prayer etc, this in truth delveops and deepens personal relationships, whilst not necessarily relating to mhystical experiences. having had such empathy enables great building of relatioships at depths greater that possible before. however sometimes it is a very lonley life. (The path of the shadow of the Cross must be followed in isolation)
Secrets etc. the Mysical life does not embrace secrets, for in secrets negative can breed and develop, bringing a risk of loss of focus that is truly needed. there are no secrets with our Lord, and as such each must be taken in turn and dealt with. annialiation of the effect of the outer as described by John of the Cross, the only way to purge the Outer errant man, to enabel the raised man of being to be recognised.
work- work must be performed to the best of ability pleasing to God, Irespective of profession. St Francis de Sales Introduction to the Devout Life can give you some ideas on how to live in the world and seek God.

One final point- wear the full armour of God, it is the only way to protect yourself, on this path. there are many pitfalls along the way.

Hope this is of help to you on your journey. God Bless.
if i can be of any other help i will be glad to.

]]> By: ‘nough said « The Website of Unknowing http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2919 ‘nough said « The Website of Unknowing Fri, 21 Dec 2007 12:01:09 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2919 [...] An anonymous blogger who calls himself “a peasant”  quoted my If… post in full yesterday on his blog Nuf Sed, and then added this gem of his own commentary: I found [...] [...] An anonymous blogger who calls himself “a peasant”  quoted my If… post in full yesterday on his blog Nuf Sed, and then added this gem of his own commentary: I found [...]

]]> By: John http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2918 John Fri, 21 Dec 2007 11:47:06 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2918 in all of this, in learning and understanding gleaned by exercices etc, we must always remember that what we think profits ourselves, what we do profits both ourselves and our neighbours, the basis of christianity. we all must substantiate that which we have learned in the charitable giving of self, of time of talent etc, in theprinciples defined through the mystical experience. awareness of the presence of God, draws each to give in love. being and doing in the cohesive state. to fulfil the plan of God, for the glory of God, remains purpose specifc for all. in all of this, in learning and understanding gleaned by exercices etc, we must always remember that what we think profits ourselves, what we do profits both ourselves and our neighbours, the basis of christianity. we all must substantiate that which we have learned in the charitable giving of self, of time of talent etc, in theprinciples defined through the mystical experience. awareness of the presence of God, draws each to give in love. being and doing in the cohesive state.
to fulfil the plan of God, for the glory of God, remains purpose specifc for all.

]]> By: Peter http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2917 Peter Fri, 21 Dec 2007 02:16:03 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2917 "What did you do before you were enlightened?" "I used to chop wood and carry water." "What do you do now that you have been enlightened?" "Well, I chop wood and carry water." I'm sure you have heard this before! I too am impressed by these questions, and intend to give them some thought. In my less-than-reverent antinomian transcendentalist self, I could give them all a flippant answer and say, "These have nothing to do with my mysticism! It stands by itself, isolated from the rest of me!" But in my practical, real, incarnationist, integral, earth-friendly self I welcome these questions as a kind of "Tickle Test" designed to reveal the authenticity (or lack of it) of my mystical life--knowing that the mystical side of my life is inseparably joined with the rest of it, that all life is sacred. It is the split between the two parts that is in line to be healed, through true integrating mystical experience--a gift of God, as the commentators (above) have been emphasizing. I will do my best to apply your questions and report the answers back to you. “What did you do before you were enlightened?”
“I used to chop wood and carry water.”
“What do you do now that you have been enlightened?”
“Well, I chop wood and carry water.”

I’m sure you have heard this before!

I too am impressed by these questions, and intend to give them some thought. In my less-than-reverent antinomian transcendentalist self, I could give them all a flippant answer and say, “These have nothing to do with my mysticism! It stands by itself, isolated from the rest of me!” But in my practical, real, incarnationist, integral, earth-friendly self I welcome these questions as a kind of “Tickle Test” designed to reveal the authenticity (or lack of it) of my mystical life–knowing that the mystical side of my life is inseparably joined with the rest of it, that all life is sacred.

It is the split between the two parts that is in line to be healed, through true integrating mystical experience–a gift of God, as the commentators (above) have been emphasizing.

I will do my best to apply your questions and report the answers back to you.

]]> By: Carl McColman http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2916 Carl McColman Thu, 20 Dec 2007 17:08:43 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2916 Of course, that's the ultimate answer (and I hinted as much with my allusion to chop wood, carry water). I also have to be honest and acknowledge that in so very many ways I fall short of who I would like to be. Which is why the Cistercian ideal of continual joyful penance speaks to me. Thankfully, as the author of <i>The Cloud of Unknowing</i> so eloquently states it, "It is not what you are nor what you have been that God sees with his all-merciful eyes, but what you desire to be." I take much comfort in that. Of course, that’s the ultimate answer (and I hinted as much with my allusion to chop wood, carry water). I also have to be honest and acknowledge that in so very many ways I fall short of who I would like to be. Which is why the Cistercian ideal of continual joyful penance speaks to me. Thankfully, as the author of The Cloud of Unknowing so eloquently states it, “It is not what you are nor what you have been that God sees with his all-merciful eyes, but what you desire to be.” I take much comfort in that.

]]> By: painterofblue http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2915 painterofblue Thu, 20 Dec 2007 16:58:07 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2915 These are interesting questions! I think I would say I'd be doing exactly what I'm doing now. The lives of mystics show us that their paths included engaging with the obstacles in their lives from illnesses (like St. Francis) to administrative challenges (like Hildegarde of Bingen founding her own convent). Our contemporary challenges may look different, but it is engaging with our challenges that makes over lives mystical, not shifting our lives to run. By shifting our lives to fix something, we ensure God will bring it to us again in different form. By sitting with a challenge and embracing it we move closer to God. These are interesting questions! I think I would say I’d be doing exactly what I’m doing now. The lives of mystics show us that their paths included engaging with the obstacles in their lives from illnesses (like St. Francis) to administrative challenges (like Hildegarde of Bingen founding her own convent). Our contemporary challenges may look different, but it is engaging with our challenges that makes over lives mystical, not shifting our lives to run. By shifting our lives to fix something, we ensure God will bring it to us again in different form. By sitting with a challenge and embracing it we move closer to God.

]]> By: John http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2914 John Thu, 20 Dec 2007 16:31:48 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2914 You can only be where you are at, not where tomorrow's mystical experiences may take you. in that today must be used to excel in awareness and understanding of the truth, drawing from the well of Christain Tradtion, learning from the scholastic mystics, where benefical, to use your all to live the christain life, and in the being and the doing, oneness in substnace can be, where Unity is. Mysticism is another term for close awareness of the presence of God, which is achieved in the single by the single in the plural, for One to be. You can only be where you are at, not where tomorrow’s mystical experiences may take you. in that today must be used to excel in awareness and understanding of the truth, drawing from the well of Christain Tradtion, learning from the scholastic mystics, where benefical, to use your all to live the christain life, and in the being and the doing, oneness in substnace can be, where Unity is. Mysticism is another term for close awareness of the presence of God, which is achieved in the single by the single in the plural, for One to be.

]]> By: Carl McColman http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2913 Carl McColman Thu, 20 Dec 2007 16:20:29 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2913 John, I agree wholeheartedly with what you've written (although I would use more inclusive language). In fact, my post assumes everything you say as a given. With that in mind, I'd be curious to know how you — or anyone else reading this — would answer my question. John, I agree wholeheartedly with what you’ve written (although I would use more inclusive language). In fact, my post assumes everything you say as a given. With that in mind, I’d be curious to know how you — or anyone else reading this — would answer my question.

]]> By: John http://www.anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2912 John Thu, 20 Dec 2007 16:15:02 +0000 http://anamchara.com/2007/12/20/if/#comment-2912 In order to live the life of the mystic there are always two conditions, that of the choice of the man and that of the will of God. therefore whilst we may long and want to be a mystic and have mystical experiences, this must always be at the behest of God. God does not owe us these experiences, nor does he offer them quid pro quo for our prayer, they are given freely, to be given freely in order to create in the plan of God. as such mystical experiecnes tends to come at a price, be careful what you wish for . to lovingly embrace the Cross, and follow that path to its triumph is all that is required of man. to he who is given, much is expected, when he is called to account. if given mysteical experiences, they are for purpose other than for selfish gain. In order to live the life of the mystic there are always two conditions, that of the choice of the man and that of the will of God. therefore whilst we may long and want to be a mystic and have mystical experiences, this must always be at the behest of God. God does not owe us these experiences, nor does he offer them quid pro quo for our prayer, they are given freely, to be given freely in order to create in the plan of God. as such mystical experiecnes tends to come at a price, be careful what you wish for . to lovingly embrace the Cross, and follow that path to its triumph is all that is required of man. to he who is given, much is expected, when he is called to account. if given mysteical experiences, they are for purpose other than for selfish gain.

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